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Pectus Dude
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Quote: Originally posted by Davy1  | One thing a few mentioned was that they totally thought it was fine to have them out after 2 years if the person had no pain. To them they meant no
pain = bones have stopped moving around and are now strong in there new place.
For me as you know I have tons of pain. However if it is nerves, then my bones are probably solid in there new place right??? Hmm I dont feel like
they are solid. I still feel like they move around. Or is that my mind playing tricks on me???
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Interesting question, Davy. One of the things I asked Professor Schaarschmidt was that if I only had one bar removed now whether he could adjust the
second bar - i.e. lift it up a bit. He said that was not feasible becuase by now the bones will have set in their new position. So, at 20 months
they are set. The story may be different for someone younger and whose bones are still growing.
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nightg
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oh well we will have to wait and see if your happy afterall this is done.
I don't think I will be back there till the 3 year mark although saving is still a big problem. And I have no pain so can't complain
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IvanR
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| Quote: Originally posted by Pectus Dude | | Quote: Originally posted by Davy1 | One thing a few mentioned was that they totally thought it was fine to have them out after 2 years if the person had no pain. To them they meant no
pain = bones have stopped moving around and are now strong in there new place.
For me as you know I have tons of pain. However if it is nerves, then my bones are probably solid in there new place right??? Hmm I dont feel like
they are solid. I still feel like they move around. Or is that my mind playing tricks on me???
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Interesting question, Davy. One of the things I asked Professor Schaarschmidt was that if I only had one bar removed now whether he could adjust the
second bar - i.e. lift it up a bit. He said that was not feasible becuase by now the bones will have set in their new position. So, at 20 months
they are set. The story may be different for someone younger and whose bones are still growing. |
I'd say that's right Troy. I'm 18 in one month so my bones will still be growing for a couple more years. Very fortunately for me, I haven't had pain
in over 4 months now; therefore, I'm going to keep my bar in as long as possible since I'm stilllyoung.
But for someone of your age, 20 months should easily be enough. If you feel this is the right decision for you and the good Dr. supports it, then go
for it.
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BullyBulldog
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Troy,I guess I always knew this day would come for you as you've been fairly clear sharing your dissapointent in particular with the rib flare. If
schaar is confident that removal at 20 months the chances of regression are minimal in comparison to removal at 36 months and you feel the way you do
then you should do what's right for you. Can schaar back up with what he is saying about the regression? How many removals at 20 months have been
carried out? How many regressed?
What are the success rates of correcting the rib flare? It didn't work for you the first time, will it work the second time?
I know your rib flare has plagued you and I can totally understand your frustration. Don't ever forget your form pre surgery, it's easy to lose sight
of that. For what it's worth I think you look good but it's not what I think that's important it's how you feel, that's all that matters.
Whatever you decide to do I pray it's a success for you, you deserve happiness and I hope you can get the form you dream of. Try to manage your
expectations of the surgery ahead, rib flare is tricky to correct and as you know it doesn't always work. I pray for you that it does.
Your a kind soul and I wish you well for the journey ahead.
Take care
BB
Nussed in the UK (NHS) on May 21st 2010 by Hans Pilegaard at the Royal Devon & Exeter Hospital.
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Pectus Dude
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This is one of the questions on my due diligence checklist. I should have an answer shortly.
| Quote: Originally posted by BullyBulldog | | What are the success rates of correcting the rib flare? It didn't work for you the first time, will it work the second time? |
Professor Schaarschmidt has told me that in some patients the correction of the rib flare does not take on the first round. He said, however, that
once the excavatum has been resolved and the bones are fixed in their new position that the second go at the rib flare usually does the job. He says
that from the photos I have sent to him it appears that the rib arches, especially the left one, have re-ascended. He has assured me that he will be
able to achieve a significant improvement but that it may not be 100% in my eyes. I will make it very clear what I expect and we will go from
there.
| Quote: Originally posted by BullyBulldog | Whatever you decide to do I pray it's a success for you, you deserve happiness and I hope you can get the form you dream of. Try to manage your
expectations of the surgery ahead, rib flare is tricky to correct and as you know it doesn't always work. I pray for you that it does.
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Thanks, BB. I pray for me, too. I want it corrected. I may stay in Helios for a couple of weeks to keep an eye on it and if it looks like it is
regressing then have him take another shot while I am still there. Where there is a will...
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edgey
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I hope it all goes well for you and you get exactly what you want!
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Skiddy
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Hi PD,
Just firstly to say I hope your decision goes well and you make everything good.
You must be really suffering to make the decision like this. Is it not really worth those extra months though? I dont want to be negative but what
if??
Waiting those extra months could be the difference between a flat chest for the rest of your life or not sorry to say.
I do think someone pointed out 2 bars can be more pain. I agree, I think its more rigid so any flexing causes the pain.
Please think hard about this. I would hate someone, one of us to go through all this for it to fail. It would be very upsetting. Good luck.
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itapol
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| Quote: Originally posted by Pectus Dude | | Quote: Originally posted by Randy |
Let me ask you this question. If the pain swiftly left you for no know reason, Would you still seek bar removal at 20 months? If you say Yes, then
Pain would not be any reason for bar removal. Would you still seek bar removal at 20 months? With no immediate pain, the only issue that remains is
the rib flare. Would you seek early bar removal, assuming no pain, to fix the flare?
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Randy, the pain is not the primary reason. As I have mentioned before, the pain is an annoyance but I have learned to deal with it. I am having
early removal to fix the worsening rib flare. Without the rib flare, I would be very happy.
Professor Schaarschmidt has told me that removal of both bars at 18 months is feasible. I will leave them in a little longer than that. I am led to
believe that the risk of regression between 20 months and 36 months, for someone of my age, is insignificant.
The other option given to me by Professor Schaarschmidt is as follows:
(1) Remove one bar and fix the ribs NOW (i.e. next month).
(2) Remove the second bar and have a go at the ribs for a third time, if necessary, at 3 years.
I don't want to have two more surgeries. So I have opted for removal of both bars at 20 months. Hopefully, God will smile upon me. If not, then I
will have to decide what to do at that time.
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I was wondering if that is even an option troy! Im glad you mentioned that. I have some touch up myself.
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Pectus Dude
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I have locked in my bar removal for 9 February 2011. That will make it exactly 21 months after the original surgery. Professor Schaarschmidt says
that at 21 months I am "very much on the safe side" and that he does not expect any regression. He says that there have been about 50 adult patients
at Helios who have had their bars removed around this time and there have not been any cases of recurrence.
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runs
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| Quote: Originally posted by Pectus Dude | I have locked in my bar removal for 9 February 2011. That will make it exactly 21 months after the original surgery. Professor Schaarschmidt says
that at 21 months I am "very much on the safe side" and that he does not expect any regression. He says that there have been about 50 adult patients
at Helios who have had their bars removed around this time and there have not been any cases of recurrence.
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Has he or anyone eplained why you and others are having so much post op pain in the first place and any other alternatives in cureing the pain
problem. That seems to be the answer that would be helpful.
Hope it all works out for you no matter what you do to make it right for you.
All the very best.......runs
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Pectus Dude
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Runs, I was diagnosed by my pain specialist with post-thoracotomy pain syndrome. It is a very complex mixture of different pains resulting from
severe damage to the upper thoracic (intercostal) nerves. My pain is under control with medication. I also exercise vigorously and do a lot of
stretching. I take warm baths every night and use various hot packs and lotions for muscle pain etc. Together, this all seems to work quite well.
However, as I have mentioned, the pain isn't the main reason I am having the bars out early. The primary reason is to fix the rib flare. I have
been vastly unhappy about the continued and worsening rib flare since the beginning and I cannot stand having my ribs protrude like this for another 2
years. My decision, which takes into account Professor Schaarschmidt's expert views on recurrence after 20+ months, is based 90% on cosmetic
considerations and 10% on pain-related issues.
This sort of decision would not be right for most people, I suspect. But I feel that it is right and necessary for me.
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relinquish
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We are ourselves the experts of what we can handle and what we cannot. I hope that your surgery in the not-so-distant-future renders the results you
desire, and to you I send my well-wishes and support.
in omnibus requiem quaesivi, et nusquam inveni nisi in angulo cum libro
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PEMom58
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PD, I am so sorry to learn that you have been having these problems. I completely understand the reason for your decision and I agree I would
personally prefer one operation to two. I see that you have now scheduled it for 21 months post-op and that you should be safe with this length of
time. I was glad to read that as I was concerned that you might have to go through this again and I would not want that for anyone.
I hope that the outcome fixes all of your problems and you can have this truly behind you. I will be watching for your posts.
Thank you for all you have and continue to do for this forum. Your support is appreciated by all.
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Chelle
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Is it just me, or does it seem like nearly all people over 40 are having a bad time with severe pain lingering over many months.
Right now, there are so many with chronic pain that I'm scared to even consider going ahead with the op'.
PD, the only thing I wonder about is the binding of the corrected rib flare. With no bar inside to counteract the pressure from the binding, is it
possible that binding the lower ribcage might also push in the upper ribcage a bit?
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Davy1
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| Quote: Originally posted by Chelle | Is it just me, or does it seem like nearly all people over 40 are having a bad time with severe pain lingering over many months.
Right now, there are so many with chronic pain that I'm scared to even consider going ahead with the op'.
PD, the only thing I wonder about is the binding of the corrected rib flare. With no bar inside to counteract the pressure from the binding, is it
possible that binding the lower ribcage might also push in the upper ribcage a bit? |
Howdy.
Could someone tell me what binding is? Also what exactly do they do when having your operation to correct rib flare?
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Davy1
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| Quote: Originally posted by Pectus Dude | Runs, I was diagnosed by my pain specialist with post-thoracotomy pain syndrome. It is a very complex mixture of different pains resulting from
severe damage to the upper thoracic (intercostal) nerves. My pain is under control with medication. I also exercise vigorously and do a lot of
stretching. I take warm baths every night and use various hot packs and lotions for muscle pain etc. Together, this all seems to work quite well.
However, as I have mentioned, the pain isn't the main reason I am having the bars out early. The primary reason is to fix the rib flare. I have
been vastly unhappy about the continued and worsening rib flare since the beginning and I cannot stand having my ribs protrude like this for another 2
years. My decision, which takes into account Professor Schaarschmidt's expert views on recurrence after 20+ months, is based 90% on cosmetic
considerations and 10% on pain-related issues.
This sort of decision would not be right for most people, I suspect. But I feel that it is right and necessary for me.
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Hey PD. Its real cool you have your date to take those bars out! Yipeeee!
Did your pain specialist say how long you will be in pain for or did they guess? Did they say those nerves are damaged and you might be like this
forever?
I pray when they take the bars out that all that pain goes away forever!
Good luck.
Davy
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edgey
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| Quote: Originally posted by Chelle | Is it just me, or does it seem like nearly all people over 40 are having a bad time with severe pain lingering over many months.
Right now, there are so many with chronic pain that I'm scared to even consider going ahead with the op'.
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Not everyone. I had my Nuss at 47 and was off percocets by 6 weeks, and after that only had pain flare ups that lasted a day or two or maybe a week
at the most ..generally due to some sort of overexertion at the gym. By about 18 months, not even that happened anymore. So, its not everyone.
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BullyBulldog
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| Quote: Originally posted by Chelle | Is it just me, or does it seem like nearly all people over 40 are having a bad time with severe pain lingering over many months.
Right now, there are so many with chronic pain that I'm scared to even consider going ahead with the op'.
?[/
Not true, pilegaard has been producing quick recoveries for many in the 40-50 age bracket. |
Nussed in the UK (NHS) on May 21st 2010 by Hans Pilegaard at the Royal Devon & Exeter Hospital.
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Ragna
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| Quote: Originally posted by BullyBulldog | | Quote: Originally posted by Chelle | Is it just me, or does it seem like nearly all people over 40 are having a bad time with severe pain lingering over many months.
Right now, there are so many with chronic pain that I'm scared to even consider going ahead with the op'.
?[/
Not true, pilegaard has been producing quick recoveries for many in the 40-50 age bracket. |
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All hospitals in Denmark follows the principal of fast track surgery, which means really short hospital stays after surgery. The principal involves
good information, focus on being painfree the first days after surgery, activity and nutrition. This way they have reduced the length of hospital stay
post surgery with 50% or more. Denmark is one of the leading contries in Europe when it comes to fast track surgery.
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villa
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I am in my mid forties with PE and have had to deal with how I look all my life. I have been away from this board for about 6 months and I cannot
believe that you are still whining about your rib flare. I wanted to write this post back then, now I wish I would have.
As long as your are a narcissist, your chest and ribs will never ever ever ever ever ever ever look the way you want them to, not ever! No matter if
you had 100 surgeries and worked out with the top trainers in the world. It will never ever ever ever happen. Never ever ever ever because your
problem is not your body, it is your head. If you don't fix your mind before February, one year from now you will still be on this board whining.
You say nothing will allow you to throw this to the back of your mind - go take a look at some photos of some wounded soldiers recently back from Iraq
and Afghanistan. Go volunteer for those who are in worse shape than you and see if you have any self-pity left because you have rib flaring. If you
do, then no amount of surgery is ever going to make you happy because you have way bigger problems than your ribs.
You have rib flaring, yes you do. You have made the choice to whine, pout and cry instead of making the choice to be happy. Happiness is a choice we
make each day. The fact that you have chosen to be so unhappy over a small part of your appearance says a lot about you. Is this really how you want
to live your life? What benefits are you getting from being so pouty and whiny, you must be getting some kind of payoff or you wouldn't keep doing
it. You are an intelligent grown man, what are you getting from this behavior - do you crave pity from others, can you think of no other way to get
attention from people? What is the payoff?
I hope for your sake that you begin to really examine your thoughts (at least as much as you examine your ribs) before you take the next step on your
nuss journey.
I wish you the best of luck!
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jojane13
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Hi Villa,
I've been wondering how you've been? It's been forever since you've posted!
I just wanted to speak up for PD because he is such a kind soul and has given so much to help others here. We all know in our heads what is important
and what isn't. But PD has been tortured psychologically by others. He's literally been made to feel hideous and unloveable by some very cruel,
shallow people, simply bc of his PE. It's true that in the grand scheme of things, flared ribs, PE, or any physical flaw isn't what matters in life.
So many people are dealing with things that are so infinitely worse that it's ridiculous to even compare our problems to theirs. But I believe that
the rejection PD faced related to his PE scarred him so deeply that he can't overcome it. At least he hasn't quite gotten there yet.
PD, I just wanted to say that while what Villa says has a lot of truth to it, I understand why you are in the mental place you're in. I'm just sorry
that you haven't been able to fully break free from the damage that was done to you when you were younger. I'm sorry because you have so many reasons
to be proud of yourself and smile when you see that face in the mirror. I hope in time it gets easier for you to see that and really feel it deep
down inside. 
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Maximus
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Strong stuff. I feel like I'm listening to my very own demon and angel sitting on my shoulders. PE really messes with peoples' heads. I ABSOLUTELY
know where PD is coming from. I've had horrible public things said to/about me about my chest. No surgery will fix that. But does that mean we
should accept less than what we want from surgery? If PD has been told that his rib flare is fixable, then it isn't too surprising that he wants it
fixed if he has the time and resources to do it.
On the extreme other hand. I've often thought that even though my PE is severe and painful every freaking day, I think about the people that have
life much worse than me and I wonder if I'm just a "complainer" and to just get on with life.
Bottomline for me: PE sucks and everyone deals with it differently. I'm glad this forum is here to tell me everything from "you're not alone" to
"suck it up".
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Sinister
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| Quote: Originally posted by villa | I am in my mid forties with PE and have had to deal with how I look all my life. I have been away from this board for about 6 months and I cannot
believe that you are still whining about your rib flare. I wanted to write this post back then, now I wish I would have.
As long as your are a narcissist, your chest and ribs will never ever ever ever ever ever ever look the way you want them to, not ever! No matter if
you had 100 surgeries and worked out with the top trainers in the world. It will never ever ever ever happen. Never ever ever ever because your
problem is not your body, it is your head. If you don't fix your mind before February, one year from now you will still be on this board whining.
You say nothing will allow you to throw this to the back of your mind - go take a look at some photos of some wounded soldiers recently back from Iraq
and Afghanistan. Go volunteer for those who are in worse shape than you and see if you have any self-pity left because you have rib flaring. If you
do, then no amount of surgery is ever going to make you happy because you have way bigger problems than your ribs.
You have rib flaring, yes you do. You have made the choice to whine, pout and cry instead of making the choice to be happy. Happiness is a choice we
make each day. The fact that you have chosen to be so unhappy over a small part of your appearance says a lot about you. Is this really how you want
to live your life? What benefits are you getting from being so pouty and whiny, you must be getting some kind of payoff or you wouldn't keep doing
it. You are an intelligent grown man, what are you getting from this behavior - do you crave pity from others, can you think of no other way to get
attention from people? What is the payoff?
I hope for your sake that you begin to really examine your thoughts (at least as much as you examine your ribs) before you take the next step on your
nuss journey.
I wish you the best of luck!
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Edit: We all struggle with the way we look for years. It is extremely hard, but not impossible, to overcome this.
I hope that PD soon gets his rib flare fixed and I believe if that happens, he will be happy.
Nussed 7 Jul 2010 by Pilegaard
Aarhus, Denmark
" Whatever you have, you must make the most of it. Rest assured that you can
transform yourself, no matter where you started from. The most important body part is
the mind.”
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MintMason
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PD,
If you recall from my earlier posts, I was extremely disappointed with the initial attempt to improve my ribs at bar-removal. Schaar actually made
things much worse than they were before the surgery. Almost a year after the initial operation I decided to see Schaar (this past March) for a
consultation regarding a second attempt. The first results were so horrible that I wanted to go over in detail with him all of my problems and
concerns. He said he understood what needed to be done and was confident that he could provide a better result. I had the second operation in late
May and there is no improvement. The second surgery was a complete waste. He did not improve upon anything that we discussed.
I dont mean for this post to discourage you from another go at rib correction. Just be aware that simply because because Schaar says he can do
something doesnt mean he can actually do it.
I hope your operation is a complete success and I wish you the best.
Mike
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Ragna
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| Quote: Originally posted by MintMason | PD,
If you recall from my earlier posts, I was extremely disappointed with the initial attempt to improve my ribs at bar-removal. Schaar actually made
things much worse than they were before the surgery. Almost a year after the initial operation I decided to see Schaar (this past March) for a
consultation regarding a second attempt. The first results were so horrible that I wanted to go over in detail with him all of my problems and
concerns. He said he understood what needed to be done and was confident that he could provide a better result. I had the second operation in late
May and there is no improvement. The second surgery was a complete waste. He did not improve upon anything that we discussed.
I dont mean for this post to discourage you from another go at rib correction. Just be aware that simply because because Schaar says he can do
something doesnt mean he can actually do it.
I hope your operation is a complete success and I wish you the best.
Mike |
Oh, I'm starting to get more and more confused here.
Is it or is it not possible to correct flarred ribs? At least I think I have read some sucsess stories at this board, can that be correct?
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